Just a discussion for things that I think need balancing. Heard of the recent nerf and it got me wildin.. fr fr!

Force Powers
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Forcepull/push needs to change so you aren't able to hit anyone while you're using it. Who thought it was a good idea for there to be an ability that basically lets you get a free kill on someone?

Choke obviously gets the same change as above

I don't think lightning or flames needs a change, they require you to stay still and vulnerable to use


Militaries
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Entire war system needs an overhaul. The combat meta right now is complaining to an admin or Damen if you don't manage to clutch
The war system deserves an entire discussion on it's own, I won't bother with typing up all that here
(Explosives Bad!)


Health
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The recent nerf is probably fine albeit I am literally vanquished on my main right now so I wouldn't know how unfair that would be. Anything above 3k health right now seems ridiculous.
Everyone related in CZ that's gotten any attention whatsoever needs their health butchered immediately to 3000 health. When it comes to fighting people in this game (the only action you get) it's literally not even fun at all. I saw Spike, THE CHOSEN ONE OF EVIL, LITERALLY GIVE UP MID COMBAT BECAUSE THE BATTLE WAS TAKING TOO LONG.

Oof.

Speaking of health, invis health:
Yeah no. This was a good idea on paper but this is just too... no... Now you can't even see if your enemy is low or not. How are we gonna catch cheaters or abusers if they have invis health? Are we just gonna question people taking thousands of damage and not say anything about it because "they have invis health we can't tell?"

If invis health was scrapped, all the buyers for it need to be compensated somehow. Maybe with a cool free create request as compensation(?)

Damage
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If having loads of health wasn't one thing, doing loads of damage is another. Why would it make sense for a trident to do 800 damage and a lightsaber (that canonically cuts almost anything in half) to do like 10?

And yes, tridents obviously aren't the most broken thing ever when it comes to damage. A handful of users (no calling out here on my Jesus loving Christian post) have accumulated so much dmg multipliers they're out here gangstering anybody with an ordinary weapon.

Combat
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This is probably the worst thing in the game right now. A skilled player just runs around like a wussy and waits to home in at the right time when their enemy is down. There's some stuff like maneuvering that's a lot more skilled but I'd appreciate OldCP combat more than this.

Despite OldCP arguably having even more CZ Bias, you could beat a user 10x as strong as you in 2017 if you could maneuver that sword/saber right. Now? You just get forcepulled and memed.

The combat system needs a rework. If I had to come up with the design myself it would be more methodical and a lot less "I'm stronger than you, have more health, faster than you, and have 10 more dmg multipliers" based. It'd be better off slower so it'd be more Star Warsy and based off blocking + attacking at the right time, instead of Dragon Ball Z where some new villain comes in and destroys everyone

What I felt OldCP got right is that it was janky but you were able to master this jankiness by fighting with other friends or having someone to train you. I feel like all my days of training as a jedi or sith would've been useless if CZ just decided to buff me relentlessly.

What the game needs to get right is a classic OldCP feel of "at the right moment" way slower placed combat than this. It's not even fun to fight anymore and that's what a lot of people have played for, lore and fighting


I don't know why I make these posts. 4-6 people will agree with them, 10 people will just look at them, a couple funny comments will be written, whatever. But I'm bored and I like the sound of typing on a keyboard. Plus what better do I have to do on DSGHQ when I'm vanquished? Play the game? I'm dead.

Might be wrong about some health and dmg stuff since I don't know exactly who got nerfed in what way because I'm not God or Damen.

Maybe I'm not. You'll never know.

Could you elaborate on how to fix combat? I’m interesting in your ideas.
It’s impossible to replicate OldCP’s because OldCP was 2d. How would you make combat better in the 3D environment?

You make a few good points here, especially the one about force pull.

Wheeler wrote on 25th January 2023, 10:10 PM:

Could you elaborate on how to fix combat? I’m interesting in your ideas.
It’s impossible to replicate OldCP’s because OldCP was 2d. How would you make combat better in the 3D environment?

Of course, we will never be able to fully replicate OldCP's combat. But we can revive it's concept.

It was slower paced in circa 2016. Penguins stood almost entirely still (until speed buffs became more prevalent for penguins) while fights went on.

Now I wasn't too big of a fan as to how slow-paced combat was. If someone just blocked the entire time you'd end up in a stalemate where the fight would last like 5 minutes long
Another thing that sucked was the spread of the earlier mentioned speed buffs that ruined the feel for OldCP combat

Going behind people or to the side was a risky move because you could've been shredded given your opponent had good reaction time. But when speed buffs were given to players this meant they could of just A-Train'd their enemies and start warping across the /jr

^ So all the above is to be kept in mind of what we shouldn't do this time. When something is about slowness we shouldn't be handing out speed buffs.

Since P3D is well, 3D, I think this offers great opportunity for a better combat environment. The reason why P3D's combat has failed us because it has a lack of a system. In OldCP you had to learn a way to fight. Now you are just running around the map blocking 24/7 honing in every now and then with your OP Speed BoostsTM to get a good hit.

The first thing that needs to change with P3D combat is that speed has to be nerfed.
When holding a weapon or engaging you should be slowed down significantly. No more memeing when you're the Flash and you can zoom around and 1 tap people with tridents.
Base speed is ridiculous in P3D anyway. The staff speed spell needs to get nerfed so it's just a Snow Shoe speed buff. I find it weird to see a fight in this game because I just see 2 people zooming across the map. This is a *mostly* Star Wars-LOTR game, but it sure feels like I'm watching Goku vs Jiren at the tournament of power sometimes.


Second, there needs to be more of a system like mentioned earlier. The ability to lock onto a player or npc maybe, so your camera gets focused onto them? In OldCP you really felt "locked onto people" because of how slow it was.

Force moves might need to be changed because of all of this. Forcepull and forcepush should be overhauled so they operate like a little burst. Use the force to send the player away to you or close to you. Because it would operate like a small burst, only pushing the player away for like a very short amount of time, peope won't be able to just hold forcepush and send people away across the map if they got good force.
I can imagine being locked on and your camera might start bugging if the enemy is pushing you and you have good force resistance so you're staying still but moving slightly back


The ability to punish people for using force moves should be added too. A startup animation would be great and then a little stun if you get hit during that startup animation. This would mean people have to use their BRAINS (i know, something we all lack here ;P) in order to use their force moves without getting punished for it.

Speaking of punishing, parrying

Maybe a system where you could either block at the right time you got hit or hit a parry button to stun your enemy if you timed it right would be great. I've seen the mosh pit strategy of people just walking slowly up to each other and just spam clicking on someone whose weaker than them. This would make that harder for them.


Keep in mind that I am absolutely no expert on game design. These are all concepts that I have seen in games I play and I just think that these are cool. If a combat system rework starts to be thought about by the developers, people should start pitching in more ideas and criticism so we can avoid a system that people have been waiting on to be horrible.

TL;DR
You have a bad attention span if you skipped this!

>Nerf speed, and slow your penguin down when it engages in combat
>Being able to lock your camera onto players
>Force moves (mostly just push and pull) acting in "bursts" *would help so people with op force dont fling you until the end of time*
>Being able to punish said force moves
>Parrying
>Adapt NPCs so they can do some of the combat basics *forgot to mention this in the full post*

Reminder that all of this will require a huge amount of effort and work so I don't really see any of this coming in the near future

Instead of disabling attacking while pushing/choking, maybe reduce damage you can do while in this state?

Damen wrote on 26th January 2023, 11:40 AM:

Instead of disabling attacking while pushing/choking, maybe reduce damage you can do while in this state?

I guess some nerf is better than no nerfs, but the damage reduction would have to be pretty significant to keep the game fair

basedbag wrote on 26th January 2023, 07:02 AM:

Quote:

Wheeler wrote on 25th January 2023, 10:10 PM:
Could you elaborate on how to fix combat? I’m interesting in your ideas.
It’s impossible to replicate OldCP’s because OldCP was 2d. How would you make combat better in the 3D environment?

Of course, we will never be able to fully replicate OldCP's combat. But we can revive it's concept.
It was slower paced in circa 2016. Penguins stood almost entirely still (until speed buffs became more prevalent for penguins) while fights went on.
Now I wasn't too big of a fan as to how slow-paced combat was. If someone just blocked the entire time you'd end up in a stalemate where the fight would last like 5 minutes long
Another thing that sucked was the spread of the earlier mentioned speed buffs that ruined the feel for OldCP combat
Going behind people or to the side was a risky move because you could've been shredded given your opponent had good reaction time. But when speed buffs were given to players this meant they could of just A-Train'd their enemies and start warping across the /jr
^ So all the above is to be kept in mind of what we shouldn't do this time. When something is about slowness we shouldn't be handing out speed buffs.
Since P3D is well, 3D, I think this offers great opportunity for a better combat environment. The reason why P3D's combat has failed us because it has a lack of a system. In OldCP you had to learn a way to fight. Now you are just running around the map blocking 24/7 honing in every now and then with your OP Speed BoostsTM to get a good hit.
The first thing that needs to change with P3D combat is that speed has to be nerfed.
When holding a weapon or engaging you should be slowed down significantly. No more memeing when you're the Flash and you can zoom around and 1 tap people with tridents.
Base speed is ridiculous in P3D anyway. The staff speed spell needs to get nerfed so it's just a Snow Shoe speed buff. I find it weird to see a fight in this game because I just see 2 people zooming across the map. This is a *mostly* Star Wars-LOTR game, but it sure feels like I'm watching Goku vs Jiren at the tournament of power sometimes.
Second, there needs to be more of a system like mentioned earlier. The ability to lock onto a player or npc maybe, so your camera gets focused onto them? In OldCP you really felt "locked onto people" because of how slow it was.
Force moves might need to be changed because of all of this. Forcepull and forcepush should be overhauled so they operate like a little burst. Use the force to send the player away to you or close to you. Because it would operate like a small burst, only pushing the player away for like a very short amount of time, peope won't be able to just hold forcepush and send people away across the map if they got good force.
I can imagine being locked on and your camera might start bugging if the enemy is pushing you and you have good force resistance so you're staying still but moving slightly back
The ability to punish people for using force moves should be added too. A startup animation would be great and then a little stun if you get hit during that startup animation. This would mean people have to use their BRAINS (i know, something we all lack here ;P) in order to use their force moves without getting punished for it.
Speaking of punishing, parrying
Maybe a system where you could either block at the right time you got hit or hit a parry button to stun your enemy if you timed it right would be great. I've seen the mosh pit strategy of people just walking slowly up to each other and just spam clicking on someone whose weaker than them. This would make that harder for them.
Keep in mind that I am absolutely no expert on game design. These are all concepts that I have seen in games I play and I just think that these are cool. If a combat system rework starts to be thought about by the developers, people should start pitching in more ideas and criticism so we can avoid a system that people have been waiting on to be horrible.
TL;DR
You have a bad attention span if you skipped this!
>Nerf speed, and slow your penguin down when it engages in combat
>Being able to lock your camera onto players
>Force moves (mostly just push and pull) acting in "bursts" *would help so people with op force dont fling you until the end of time*
>Being able to punish said force moves
>Parrying
>Adapt NPCs so they can do some of the combat basics *forgot to mention this in the full post*
Reminder that all of this will require a huge amount of effort and work so I don't really see any of this coming in the near future

Fyi I did read this, some good ideas