Glory to the Lord of the Flies! May his reign over the empty playground be neverending!

Me and the boys on the way to take down the current South mafia state

Better proposal: Remove Turq's ability to lock rooms. He's literally the only one who does it

Turq a walking L

You will be avenged, son

SentFromTheTrash wrote on 12th January 2023, 08:08 PM:

Quote:

basedbag wrote on 12th January 2023, 07:58 PM:
Thank you for posting this so I didn't sound like a prick habibi.

Language!

You're mother

Damen wrote on 7th November 2022, 11:58 AM:

I've upgraded the server that forums was running on. If something is broken, tell me in this post.

Some of the replies show accounts with 0 posts and no badges

They booed him for he spoke the truth

Why'd this get so many dislikes? I thought it was a cool read. A canon storyline as to how each House was first established would be pretty cool

How about instead of trying to make it so that every person has more or less the same strength/health, you add more methods to actually farm strength? Then those "left behind" can catch up.

How the hell did I not get a special mention

Damn, I gotta get a certificate next year

Amazing work

Loki wrote on 19th June 2022, 12:04 PM:

Can we get a TLDR?

Yeah, it turned out a lot longer than I expected. Will add it in a bit

TL;DR - While I understand not everyone wants to read the entire thing, I would highly recommend you do so.
Reveal Spoiler

--

Initially, this was going to be a reply under Basedbag's post: "OldCP's Death", but the reply turned out to be so long that I figured I'd rather make it its own post.

I'll rip off the band-aid while everyone's still reading: OldCP is dead, and you can't bring it back.

OldCP was a product of the Club Penguin era, back when Club Penguin was THE game for kids. All your friends would have Club Penguin accounts, and you'd log on with them after school to "waddle around". But, because of the heavy paywall the game had in the form of "Membership", the more shrewd kids would flock to private CPPS'es (Club Penguin Private Servers) for stuff like free membership, custom items, and other features not present in the original game. And OldCP really stood out among the rest because of its unique style and a little something called "crimezone", which kept the game alive for as long as it did. Like the parties on Club Penguin, OldCP had stories and events that users would be able to take part in, earning stuff like ranks, weapons and recognition from "crimezone characters" throughout the process. This was something that no other CPPS had done before, and it revolutionized OldCP as a staple of its time. Detectives, Blackhawks, Iceghosts, Djinns... The list goes on and on.

But that era is dead.

Club Penguin is gone, most of the popular CPPS'es were shut down (willingly or forcibly), and the kids who grew up playing those CPPS'es, including OldCP, have all grown up and, for the most part, moved on. I was 11 when I joined the DSGHQ for the first time, now I'm 19. I should have left a long time ago, but I'm here for the same reason that the ones from my generation reading this post are: Nostalgia. Let's not kid ourselves, those of us from the old OldCP generation who still log on to the game every now and then do it purely for nostalgia sake. SG might cook up some cz every now and then, but that is just you trying to relive nostalgia, even if for a short bit. Do I think you're wrong to do that? Of course not. OldCP was a game that we all have fond memories of. But to think that you can bring it back is simply delusional, for various reasons.

The Death of Flash
OldCP, like all Club Penguin and all its remakes, was made with Flash. Flash was THE software used to make browser games back in the day. Newgrounds, FRIV, and all these different game hosting websites hosted THOUSANDS of different Flash browser games that you could have played at any given time. And that was gaming for most of us. But now, Flash is dead, by every definition of the word. Adobe discontinued its Flash support on late 2020 and browsers like Chrome and Firefox have removed Flash from their browsers. There were multiple reasons for it, but the 2 that are important here is that:

1) Flash Player was oudated, and HTML5 has basically rendered it obsolete. You can read more about it here.

2) Flash was a MASSIVE security risk. I'm not tech savvy enough to explain why, so I'll let Karolis Liucveikis, a software engineer of 5 years, do it for me:

Quote:

Not many websites use Adobe Shockwave anymore. Not only does it have security issues, it’s awkward because it causes the browser to load an external file, called a .dll on Windows and .so on Linux. (If you do that with an unsigned .dll it would throw up an error in Windows. Adobe Shockwave is signed by Microsoft.) A .dll is a security risk because that launches a new process with access to its own memory. Hackers use exactly that approach to gain access to the operating system.

Adobe Flash is different, but not much. That runs inside the same process and memory as the web browser. But frequent bugs in that software give hackers lots of opportunities to gain access to memory. When they do that, they can cause the browser to jump to a specific memory address and take control of the machine.

(Full article is here for those who want to read more on it.)

Flash was a software that would have continued to be overwhelmed by security issues, so it was abandoned entirely. And now you want to continue OldCP, a game that is basically on life support, in the sense that it only works as a downloadable file with its own embedded Flash plugin. Not only has OldCP lost the charm it once had as a browser game, it is still on Flash, meaning that it is still, again, a MASSIVE security risk. If Damen were to try and advertise the game, not only would it not attract any because of its wildly outdated format, but the game would also be potentially be taken down by Disney, because it still infringes on their trademark.

"But what if Damen imported OldCP to HTML5?" I hear you asking yourself. And yeah, he could do it. But,
1) Let's be honest, he won't
2) Even if he did, it wouldn't re-populate the game, because:

OldCP, as a game, is outdated
Penguin Chat, Club Penguin's predecessor was, at its core, was a very simple project. It started as an online chat website with penguin themed avatars and some cool background scenery. They would later add a few minigames here and there when it was released as Club Penguin, but for the most part, that was it. Club Penguin wasn't a game, it was an online chat website disguised as a game.



But it managed to take advantage of a niche that was already present and popular at the time: A virtual world, geared towards children, in which you could hang out with friends and meet new people. And Club Penguin quickly capitalized on this by adding new features that slowly transitioned Club Penguin from a chat website with a cool theme, to an online MMO. Especially after its acquisition by Disney, Club Penguin became this massive game with a constant stream of new content that was worked on by a dedicated team, just so that these kids could have some fun. New parties and events kept the game alive and fresh, and made people want to come back for more. This would make sure the game was constantly full of users, causing even more people to log on. Not to mention that, as a kid, besides seeing your friends in real life, this was really the only way to talk to them. What were you going to use instead, Skype? Of course not. All of your friends were on Club Penguin.



OldCP, originally advertised as a Club Penguin remake, was based on the era of the game before Disney's acquisition, back when the game was simpler. However, instead of doing what most other CPPS'es did, aka making new events and parties for the game, OldCP focused on something else entirely: "Crimezone". Helmed by Damen, crimezone was a series of semi-scripted events written in advance by Damen, in which certain characters would log onto the game, cause certain events, and the users would then guide the story from there. This would happen on a regular basis, adding lore and extra depth to an otherwise pretty mundane Club Penguin remake. OldCP already had a steady userbase, as did most CPPS'es at the time, but the addition of crimezone and weapons added a unique trait to the game that made it stand out from others.

However, as time moved on, crimezone became so complex and convoluted that unless you were there since the start, you would never have a full grasp on what was really going on. And because of this, the older users would always benefit the most from crimezone, being given exclusive titles and benefits that newer users wouldn't. And remember, OldCP was based on the old version of Club Penguin, without any minigames or events, meaning the only thing you could do in the game, besides talking to your friends, was to participate in crimezone.

Because crimezone continued to get more complex and convoluted, it became exclusive to the older users of the game, meaning new users had absolutely nothing to do in the game. This led to the game facing a major issue: When the old generation started to outgrow the game, there was no new generation to take their place. This was a key feature that kept Club Penguin alive for so long. When people outgrew the game, there would be new people to take their place. But that never happened with OldCP. The game continued to cater to the generation that it started with, and by the time it realized the error in doing this, it was far too late, and OldCP had no choice but to continue catering to that generation, resulting in most of the userbase outgrowing the game and the game completely dying out.

Damen made an attempt to re-populate the game by paying a Spanish YouTuber to advertise the game, and while this did spike user activity for a bit, the game eventually died again because:
1) The main language of the game is English, not Spanish
2) OldCP doesn't have any of the features that make it a sustainable CPPS, and cz was far too convoluted and exclusive for the new users to be able to get into.

--
In summary, OldCP, as a game and project, is dead, and will never return for these 3 simple reasons:
1) It is a Club Penguin remake, and can be shut down at any time by Disney
2) It is hosted on the now defunct software Adobe Flash
2) The game doesn't have any of the features that makes a CPPS sustainable in the long-term, making it pointless to advertise

Now, that is where the post should have ended, but after reading BasedBag's post and seeing the overall attitude about how iOldCP should be brought back, I decided to continue the post with a segment on how DSGHQ should move forward starting now.

Bringing back iOldCP is NOT the solution
iOldCP, an OldCP remake/alternate universe, was a game that Damen made as a little reward to those who supported him on Patreon. Basically, if you pledged to his Patreon, you would have access to this version of OldCP that is run, and can only be played by, other Patreon users. It was a neat little thing that got people to pledge to Damen's Patreon. But Damen would remove the Patreon requirement, make it exclusive only to people w/ a certain badge on forums, and would eventually outright make the game public, for anyone to play.

iOldCP was a good opportunity for the users to prove what they long thought was the reason for OldCP's decline: Poor management by Damen. So SG got to work crafting iOldCP under his own ideals. While iOldCP was even more popular than OldCP at one point, it only amplified the worse aspects of OldCP by making cz even more exclusive, having even worse and more corrupted admins, and being an even harder game for new users to get into. The game basically became SG's own playground, and most of the old admins, myself included, can attest that the game became more toxic and more insufferable than OldCP instead. Damen, who realized this, eventually merged both games together and continued the project as OldCP. However, SG had another chance at running the game again, when Damen decided that OldCP was no longer worth overseeing himself and appointed 3 Wardens to look after it in his stead: Me, SG, and Randy. SG would eventually convince Damen to let him solely run OldCP. And how did that go?


Yeah...

Point is, regardless of whoever ran the game, even someone like SG, who could do all the technical stuff that Damen acould, the game was still beyond saving, because by then, the game had gone too far down the crimezone rabbit hole to be redeemed as a sustainable CPPS.


The Solution: Penguin3D
P3D is possibly the best project Damen's worked on by far. Proof that one dedicated person is all it takes to craft a 3D virtual world. But the game is heavily flawed. P3D is a a Unity adaptation of OldCP, an attempt modernize the game. Along with it, however, came all the problems that OldCP was suffering from: The lack of features that made OldCP a "game", and the heavy reliance on "crimezone" to bring the game any activity. To someone with no history with OldCP or any knowledge of it, P3D is an empty sandbox which gets populated every now and then so users can huddle around 1 user that they've never met before, will never respond to them, and will abruptly leave, causing everyone else to leave as well. Due to this nature of the game , at least 90% of the day, the game experiences downtime, in which nobody is online. So there's nobody these new users can interact with either. How can you expect new users to find any enjoyment from this?

P3D is a sandbox, except it isn't. A sandbox implies that you can do anything you want within the confines of the game. A good example for a sandbox would be something like Gmod, which gives you all the tools you need to make whatever you want on the game. P3D is not that. P3D is extremely limited in the ways you can change it. There's an igloo editor, but that's about it.

P3D isn't supposed to be a sandbox either. Damen would have to put tremendous amounts of effort to give P3D a 10th of the availability that a game like Gmod provides, and I don't think Damen should try and turn P3D into a sandbox either. He should turn it into a playable game, which anyone who plays, new or old, can enjoy. I have a few ideas that would possibly help Damen achieve this:

1. Add more game content, like minigames
Outside of exploring, the game has nothing to do. That's why the game needs content that would entice new users and convince them to stay. Minigames would be a good start to that. While it sounds like a small addition, minigames were the cornerstone that turned Club Penguin from a glorified chatroom to an actual game. If you want users to actually join the game, you need to give them something to play.

2. Add a tutorial
P3D is a game that has different mechanics and places to see, but a new user has no way to figure out all of it by themselves. Adding a proper tutorial would be beneficial to helping them learn what the game has to offer.

3. Advertise
Club Penguin and early OldCP was as popular as it was because of its thriving userbase. But now, the most we get are a few Spanish users coming in here and there, which have no reason to stay, because barely anyone is usually on to begin with. If the game is advertised through a popular English YouTuber, then the game would have a massive influx of users, and once they saw that there was actual stuff to do in the game, they would stick around.

4. Hire a small team of people
I know P3D is a passion project, but it's a game too grand for Damen to tackle by himself. If Damen hires a team of paid, or maybe even volunteer, people to help him design and code, more content would be churned out for the game. Damen introducing Content Artist is a promising start, but right now, most of the "new content" added by the Content Artists caters to the Content Artists themselves (Arda Temple, personal cosmetics, etc). There's a few new items on the outfit store, but they're completely random, and without any theme or consistency.

5. Get your act together
(Directed at Damen)
You're the owner of the game, yet you're the hardest person to contact within it. The lack of the mods' or admins' capability to change core aspects of the game means we have to come to you when we have a complaint, or a request. I get that you're busy, but if you're going to continue to be this hard to get in contact with, then it's just going to put users off from playing the game entirely. You've made a game here. A game that people play and expect its owner and sole developer to care about. Either get your act together and start caring about the game or appoint someone else to care about it for you.

Conclusion
This is the state of OldCP.



It is dead, and trying to revamp it or bring it back under the iOldCP name is a delusion that will result in nothing. You're only tarnishing OldCP's legacy by turning it into your own personal playground. If you genuinely respect Damen and his work, you'll stop bothering him to bring back iOldCP and instead help him continue to develop P3D.

OldCP is dead. Let it rest.